Is it just me?

[mlue]

There was a comment made about unconditional love and acceptance...and at the same point you can still be disappointed or disagree but that does not change how you feel.

I absolutely agree....unconditional love and acceptance does not mean that you agree with everything or they never disappoint. It means that all those things can't change how you feel.

lol...ok...I see this different too. Sorry you all are gonna boot me out of here.

While something may not change how you feel, it does not always follow that the recipient feels that love and acceptance. How many times do we all feel unloved or unaccepted when somebody is expressing their disappointment in us? It may not mean they don't love us but as the recipient of that disappointment, we may not feel loved.

Personal example...my husband is very critical (think of the song Boy...that's what it sounds like around our house a lot of the time). I am very concerned about the impact of this on my kids because I'm not sure as the recipients of that criticism they feel loved. Now I know for a fact he loves them and I think in their heads they know he loves them but do they feel loved....I don't think so. I think they feel discouraged.

In the case of fan/celebrity, I don't know that in that distant kind of relationship, it is possible for them to feel loved and accepted amidst the criticism even if they are.

Additionally...I question whether all of it is unconditional love and acceptance in the fan/celebrity scenario. I think perhaps there are actually a lot of expectations "required" for that love. Perhaps that is why it is not very fulfilling. People wouldn't leave if it was unconditional love.

Anyway...that's my take on that for what its worth.

[Dyan]

Originally posted by mlue:
While something may not change how you feel, it does not always follow that the recipient feels that love and acceptance. How many times do we all feel unloved or unaccepted when somebody is expressing their disappointment in us? It may not mean they don't love us but as the recipient of that disappointment, we may not feel loved.

<font size="3" face="Tempus sans ITC, Papyrus,Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">That is absolutely true. Perhaps it's why I tend to focus more on a person's actions. Esp those actions over time. I think it's easy to show unconditional love and to feel loved when things are good ........ it's when things aren't so good that the true nature of things tends to show. Even then, I think the broader picture is important because emotions can color things in the heat of the moment.

Originally posted by mlue:
People wouldn't leave if it was unconditional love.

<font size="3" face="Tempus sans ITC, Papyrus,Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">People don't leave. We get pissed. We do the cyber version of storming out and slamming the door behind. Often with a loud "I hate you, and I'm never coming back." But we never really leave. ....... haven't you noticed? LOL

[sunhawk]

i don't have a problem with Darren giving certain fans special treatment in itself, it's bothered me in certain specific incidents but over all i tend to just treat it as the way things are, seeing as i've been friends with people who were actual friends with Darren or met him or were involved with Sony and such. It wouldn't be fair to tell them they shouldn't get treated differently or Darren shouldn't mention them because he can do whatever he likes really, there's never been a time i can think of where he bathed anyone in attention to the point of excess.

Well Sony decided to not make it clear why Dyan was being dismissed and i think we are aware that we are just speculating, that lack of clear message leaves a lot to be interpretted *chuckle*

You are right that often people don't know they are being loved, mostly because we aren't mindreaders and sometimes words/actions/etc don't reflect ones emotions or intentions. But what does our love really mean to Darren, at the end of the day? We are faceless for the most part, usually thought of as a group and we're unpredictable and probably frustrating sometimes, adorable sometimes, any number of emotions. From time to time we stand out as individuals, such as at the meet and greets, but we must blur in his mind when he's considering his fanbase as a whole. So if we don't make him think we love him or love him enough, how seriously does he take that? Maybe in the past he was more concerned with what we said and did but lately i've gotten a real feeling that he is keeping his distance and mostly staying out of things, and maybe i'm wrong about that.

[BarbT]

Originally posted by sunhawk:
Maybe in the past he was more concerned with what we said and did but lately i've gotten a real feeling that he is keeping his distance and mostly staying out of things, and maybe i'm wrong about that.

<font size="3" face="Tempus sans ITC, Papyrus,Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I don't think you're wrong Steen I agree with you and to an extent I've been doing a bit of the same.

I've spent some time reading threads elsewhere last night and today and I've noticed that although we are many and we share differing views we all are passionate about our own feelings. I'd like to think I've never personally attacked another fan just because of how they feel, what ticks me off and gets me going is someone else attacking someone in the smaller minority who takes a courageous step and tries to speak up. Ah it's just overwhelming, confusing and tiring and as Janie has said some time ago it's like someone has killed the joy. I've never experienced another artist that takes you on a ride from elation to misery and back again fairly often, but that is me and how my fan experience pans out depends on my frame of mind at time I'm online.

Oh and I think we should have a lottery to tip when the next d-zine will surface
[img]tongue.gif[/img]

[Kattitude]

LOL Dyan thats so true.

We stomp our feet we post our posts. We vent and vent. We just like to make sure we get it out there. But no we havent left at all.

It's easy to like someone when its all good and you feel all good towards them. It can be incredibly taxing at times to still love/like someone when they what they have done has pissed you, maddened you, frustrated you, annoyed you etc etc.

Kat


Kat

[mlue]

*chuckles*...I think the odds are to unpredictable to even try and gamble on the next d-zine surfacing.

[BarbT]

replies just to get Mlue's last reply to show up. For some silly reason the new page doesn't load until there is more than 1 message and that has happened twice now [img]eek.gif[/img]

[Dyan]

I don't get it. What is there about this fan base and that man that got under my skin??? I SWEAR, I'm a perfectly normal person with a firm grasp on reality. And yet ....... *sighs*

You guys won't understand what I'm saying in this ramble, and I realize that. But the thing is that I just deleted two posts on two different boards. Why? They were perfectly good posts, and I think that I have a point. Frankly, I think that I'm right. And they weren't causing trouble or fights. And yet somehow pointing out what seems obvious to me seemed also somehow the wrong thing to do.

It was about the recent articles in Australia about how Sony US didn't want to release the cd because it's supposedly too explicit and sexual. And the thing is that I posted and then it nagged me .......... somehow it seemed unfair for me to ...... I dunno how to explain this ...... maybe the word that I'm looking for is "counter". Maybe it's unfair of me to counter what other fans want or need to believe and what Darren's public relations team may want out in the media. Damn, that's not the right word either.

WHY do I even care??? It's not like my opinions change anyone's mind or that anyone (ie Darren's team or even him) could care less what I of all people think. And yet ............ damn if it didn't seem wrong on my part to be openly cyncial and blunt.

People need to believe something. And if that something helps to explain Darren's absence in the US or lets his fans feel better about the state of things (or even Darren himself; hell, I don't know what he needs to believe), then maybe I should let that be.

<font color="#9966FF" size="1">[ March 06, 2005 09:01 PM: Message edited by: Dyan ]</font>

[little bird]

I have been reading this thread for awhile now and as usual, everyone's articulate replies have given me lots to think about. It has been comforting to know that I'm not the only one who feels frustrated, but it is sad as well. I do agree with Laurie that if fans are geniunely 100% supportive I respect that ,and those fans that have concerns or issues are are just as valid. It seems like there can be so little respect for difference of opinion somtimes, though. People too easily can have their feelings and opinions invalidated just because someone else doesn't agree. I saw a thread on another board where someone was basically expressing concern for the way things were going, and others took it as not having faith in Darren. I didn't see it as not having faith and if you didn't care about someone's career, why would it matter what they they were doing or how well they were doing but what do I know? I just wish that we could all remember that we aren't going to see things the same way and that even you don't agree, respect is important. I remember when Dyan was removed as moderator from the Sony BBS and being on the board that night *sighs* I think that it was completely wrong the way it happend and the way it was handled. I can never forget how difficult things were when SG split. I couldn't agree more with Marilue how little love and acceptance there was.. I remember lots of powerful emotions, lots of hurt and blame on both sides. To be honest, the most difficult things for me at the time was seeing how other fans were reacting, to see how hurt and sad people were and all that blame. I was ceratinly upset and dissapointed, but I admit I was also more philosophical about the split then.. I was trying to focus on being grateful that SG ever exisisted in the first place, and I still feel that no one is to blame. Now, years after I find myself really beginning to start greiving over it..I have really been missing and longing for SG more than ever and as as stupid as it sounds, the main reason is that I want to go back to that time and feel the way I used to feel. I realize that not everything was perfect then either, but I felt much more connected, to Darren, to the fan base, everything. There seemed to be more openess and sharing. Now I don't really feel any joy. I'm just desperately trying to remember the positive things what brought me here in the first place because I'm very tempted to just leave it all behind especially the online part of being a fan (not that it matters I know) As I write this my Lauch Cast station is playing "Gunning Down Romance"..pretty appropriate

<font color="#9966FF" size="1">[ March 06, 2005 12:26 PM: Message edited by: little bird ]</font>

[sunhawk]

a good point mlue, i can certainly say there have been times when i felt completely "battle worn", usually not even because i am getting too emotionally involved, but just the act of intellectual expression itself and my desire to express myself correctly can be a strain, i seem to push myself harder when speaking about/within this fandom than any other i am a part of. Heck, most of the other fandoms i am a part of, i mostly stay quiet and don't even frequent any fan boards.

I think it's good to think about your own postings and your reasonings/motives but i don't think any of us should be too harsh with ourselves for feeling what we feel, shouldn't second-guess our every move. I guess it's that fine line between thoughtfulness and action.

It's funny, there is a song i just got my hands on by a band i love, Kula Shaker, and it seems strangely suitable for our current turn of topic ^_^ it's called "Drop in the Sea"

Questions unfolding like books and their pages
They just keep on turning for me
And I keep on asking,
Why every question will somehow relate back to me

Oh, I was told by a knight of the sun,
That wisdom could set people free
Be content in your questions
And may I just mention
You?re only a drop in the sea

Direction revolving
These questions I?m solving but nobody hears what I say
My answers unspoken of sweetest emotion,
Believe how I feel today
Just believe how you feel today

Oh, I was told by a knight of the sun,
That wisdom could set people free
Be content in your questions
And may I just mention
You?re only a drop in the sea

I don't think you need to worry Dyan, because i think at the end of the day, we are all just drops in the sea of Darren's fanbase ^_^


And, since i'm on the topic of Kula Shaker, i remembered a song i've always associated with my connection to the DH fandom, why i stay, why i am here, thought i might share the lyrics as well heh heh

I was sure I heard you singing
While my head was broken up
While my world in flames was rearranged
I'm still here.

In a blazing forest fire,
In a web of my own desires,
In a place that we are destined to return.

On an ocean I can't fathom,
In a truth I can't unravel,
I'm still here.

I'm still here.